TELL US: Should Mass. Blue Laws Be Eliminated?
Blue laws prohibit retailers from opening before midnight on Black Friday.
Black Friday is starting earlier than ever, as some national retailers have announced they will open the night of Thanksgiving, Thursday, Nov. 22. However, here in Massachusetts, state blue laws prohibit stores from opening until midnight, according to a report by the Boston Globe.
Current blue laws prohibit retailers in the state from opening on Thanksgiving, thus preventing them from getting an early start on Black Friday sales, according to the Globe article. Some exceptions are restaurants, health care facilities and gas stations.
The laws, instituted in the 17th century, are intended to make sure holidays are properly observed, according to the Boston Globe.
Are Massachusetts' blue laws outdated? Should they be eliminated? Tell us in the comments section below.
Emcee of Seekonk
11:29 am on Thursday, November 15, 2012
"Are Massachusetts' blue laws outdated?" Yes.
"Should they be eliminated?" Wouldn't hurt.
The time of 'over the hill and thru the woods to grandmother's house we go' is pretty much over. Families are smaller and spread all over the country. I say, let retailers make it while they can.
MICHELLE D
12:15 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
If Blue Laws are eliminated that would mean NO "time and a half" Sunday pay which would mean less money the pockets of many.
Less money = less shopping
less shopping = less spending
less spending = less work
less work = less employees
less employees = more out of work
more out of work = higher taxes to pay for welfare and unemployment
KEEP THE BLUE LAWS!
Emcee of Seekonk
2:11 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
Interesting argument.
Just Saying
3:35 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
Working on Sunday doesn't equate to "time and a half". Most, if not all, companies/businesses that are open 7 days a week schedule their employees days off on weekdays.
Jack
6:19 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
But.... if you get rid of them stores open earlier on Thanksgiving more sales tax revenue would come into the state coffers. And, if you get rid of other Blue Laws, the same would happen i.e. Happy Hour.
Carol Bragg
12:00 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
I don't understand the claim that more money will come into the state's coffers if stores open 3 hours earlier for Black Friday. Why do we assume that people will have more money to spend if the stores are open 3 hours longer? I assume they'll have the same amount of money to spend that will yield the same amount of sales tax. It's just an issue of when the money is spent.
Jack
2:59 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
@Carol Staggered openings give people more time to hit up all the stores they want. They can be at Wally World from 8-10, Target 10-12, etc, etc. They'd be more likely to spend more money if they visit more stores. And, the more they travel, the more gas (or public transportation) they use, and that's additional money. It also means companies pay their employees more cash (which will put money in their pockets to spend) and means they are paying more employment taxes. By your logic, we should shutter all stores and just give each other checks for the holidays.
paul
2:11 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
Keep the Blue Laws! Black Friday and midnight madness only helps retailers. People think they are saving, guess again. All the madness with long lines, traffic jams and stampedes is crazy. Last year a guy had a heart attack and died in Walmart and people kept walking around him. Shop on-line!
Emcee of Seekonk
3:24 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
The only flaw in your argument is that Massachusetts depends on the revenue from retail sales. Look at today's Sun Chronicle... "The state is running a $256 million budget deficit because tax revenue is coming in slower than expected,...". So now the state will begin to tax online purchases as soon as they can get things lined up. If that's not enough, they'll do something else: up the gas tax, cut someone's benefits.
Now, I'm no kind of shopper and wouldn't spend two minutes in a crowded store and I really don't care about Blue Laws or no Blue Laws, but every decision has consequences. Bottom line: the state depends on revenue from sales taxes. Do we want to deny that?
deb of see-attleboro
3:23 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
I think we are at the point of no return. It is already too difficult to get family together to celebrate or observe anything of importance.
No problem for funerals, though. Something to look forward to:(
Carol Bragg
4:52 pm on Thursday, November 15, 2012
One good reason not to have stores open on Thanksgiving night is that Black Friday events require additional policing. I say, give the police a break. They have families. The Thursday night openings are not going to make a huge difference in revenue from sales taxes. People who would go at 9 PM will show at midnight instead. It's more a matter of competition among stores and which store gets the early shoppers lured away from their families to get a good deal. Make Thanksgiving a family-valued day. If we can't celebrate and be thankful for families, we've really lost it as a society. What are we teaching our children about values? Rush from the dinner table and go out and shop?
kathy
12:00 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
I agree fully
GiRRL_Earth
2:27 pm on Tuesday, November 20, 2012
I also agree.
kathy
12:00 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
No we should not repeal the Blue Laws. Family time has been zapped away due to sunday shopping, holiday shopping times.As a matter of fact some of the old ones should be put back. Who wants to go to work on Thanksgiving night for shoppers ? I know all our emergency and hospital workers have to go but that is different. Sorry, because I know they miss being home also with their families. But stores, leave them closed .
GiRRL_Earth
2:27 pm on Tuesday, November 20, 2012
agreed.
Just Me!
12:00 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
I suppose there has to be a bit of control by the state...just to keep things on an even keel......since I don't participate in the whole black friday hooplah....I kinda sit back..watch the show on TV, checkin out the people waiting out in line to get good deals. "Crazy" one of my longtime friends once said to me after watching a segment on the local news. I looked at him and said "What's the difference between those folks waiting in line to get into a store and You and me spending MANY a cold night waiting in line at The Providence Civic Center or Boston Garden 35 years ago to get blocks of front row concert seats for us and our friends???" "A point well taken" he said to me and had a new respect for the folks sitin' out all night!!
Richard W. Lunt
12:00 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Keep the Blue Laws. People need time together for the important things in life, family and friends, especially on Thanksgiving. Shopping can wait until the next day.
Steve C
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Richard please explain how the blue laws effect family time? If you don't want to go shopping then don't go, I certainly won't be going. I am in my 40's and have never stepped foot in a store on Black Friday, but, don't care if they are open or closed either.
Avon Barksdale
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Richard is correct, we need less freedom, not more. We need the government to tell us when to shop, and when to spend time with our families. We need to understand that as individuals, we will make horrible, childlike decisions but the government can correct our errant ways through its inherent goodness.
Stoughton12
12:04 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
RIchard and I are taking the point of view that if the store you work at decides to open on Thanksgiving, someone has to be there to operate it. Until stores are run by the robots, they will need to be run by employees that have a good chance of having relatives that just might want to see them over the holiday. So instead of sitting down and having dinner\lunch or what have you, they are at Target waiting on people that don't care about their families or maybe buying their tv dinner. You have obviously been fortunate enough not to have a family member miss a meal with their loved ones unlike the doctors, nurses, healthcare, fire, police etc etc go through each year to cover shifts. Granted, they are there to save lives, not to sell a trinket you can get the next day. So go ahead, repeal the Blue laws, and when it's your turn to miss a family gathering so you can cover your shift at 7-11 so you can sell a quart of egg nog.
Avon Barksdale
12:25 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
I've had plenty of jobs that required coverage on holidays. Including crisis coverage for persons with disabilities. Guess what, they still need help on holidays, it's not like you can shut down group homes and hospitals and say "we'll get back to those folks on December 26th." Just because some people might miss dinner is no reason to hold the retail industry hostage.
Tina Silverio
12:12 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
I don't participate in that madness, but as far as Black Friday goes, I don't think it's much of the government's business to say whether or not a store can be open or not. Stores inside the confined of a closed shopping mall would be subject to that property owners' ideas on the matter, and the free-standing box stores would get most of the business (which they do anyways.). Smaller independently-owned biz might not be so likely to jump on the bandwagon, as the families that own them might prefer to be at home with families. As far as the shoppers go, sure a lot of us think it's more important to be home with family, but there's plenty of people for whom that's not an issue for one reason or another.
Steve C
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Why does it matter when the stores open? If you don't agree with the policy don't go. I still don't grasp the concept of Black Friday at all. Just go shopping when ever the hell you want to. I like the idea that stores could be open all the time. Shorter lines, more hours for employees, more employees needed, and most of all maybe some of the people on Patch will go shopping and give us a break from all the bitching.
Who do we think we are to impose such regulations on a business? If it has no damaging impact on the community then let it happen.
Vera Jordan
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
KEEP THE BLUE LAWS! Families and friends should be able to enjoy Thanksgiving together for the whole day. period. Shopping addicts can easily go on line to capture big bargains. Opening retail stores on Thanksgiving cuts into this time and for many, will eliminate it. There is much more to life than the marginal profit a company MIGHT make by opening early.
Ken Tenglin
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
The "blue laws" limit the choices of businesses and individuals to make decisions that can benefit them. The laws are just another example of government overreaching it's authority. Let the people and the markets decide what is best for them.
Just Saying
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
The government doesn't own or operate the stores, they should not legislate hours of operation. If you want more time with your family, don't shop. If family members want to go shop, so be it. That is a family issue, not a goverment issue.
Chris
10:03 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
If the blue law disappear. Why bother having holidays? It's all a ruse about more money. People who need to shop will still spend the same amount of money regardless if they go out on Black Friday or the day before Christmas. Let the employees have their family holidays off. There isn't many left that everything is shut down. Days have gone buy where stores were closed on Sundays & every holiday all the stores were closed. Even Labor day people have to work, really what's the point now?
GiRRL_Earth
2:27 pm on Tuesday, November 20, 2012
That's a good point. Why bother when everything is open 24/7. I work for a large private firm and the only time we close is when the stock market is closed. Otherwise, we are open for business. At the rate we are headed, there will be no such thing as a "holiday".
Just Saying
10:06 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
^^ * government
Richard W. Lunt
10:57 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
As I stated earlier, Thanksgiving is for being together with family and friends and being thankful for what each one has in their life. I worked in the retail industry for a few years and based on my own experience, even the retail workers need a time for themselves and family, what better way is there than not to have to work in a store on Thanksgiving. Eliminating the Blue Laws would ensure that stores can open on Thanksgiving which I think would set a bad precedent about what the important issues are; spending time with family and loved ones during the holidays.
Avon Barksdale
11:17 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Richard, please tell us in which other situations the government should decide our priorities for us, thanks.
Just Saying
10:57 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Blue Laws are discriminatory. They mainly apply to retail stores, banks & government offices. What about all the hospital employees, police, fire, ambulance, toll workers, prison workers, hotel workers, etc...?
deb of see-attleboro
11:07 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Maybe once the blue laws are completely eliminated, we will see the union ranks grow in number. Who else is going to protect workers from exploitation?
Maybe that's the point. Be careful what you wish for.
Avon Barksdale
12:03 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
Actually it would likely result in far more increases in temporary and part-time help and have almost no impact on union ranks, no need to worry about what will actually happen though, right?
Richard W. Lunt
11:47 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
Avon,
Other than the Blue Laws, the government should stay out of our lives. The current Blue Laws are much more relaxed than they once were, I remember during the 70's and early 80's here in Massachusetts the retailers were not allowed to open on Sunday's let alone on holidays. I think the current Blue Law system works best, stores are able to open on Sundays, and are not allowed to be open on Thanksgiving and Christmas, two of the most important family holidays of the year.
Avon Barksdale
12:03 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
The Blue Laws are the one exception, and government should not interfere anywhere else? Great, let's get all the abortion laws off the books and get government out of telling people who they can and cannot marry. Thanks for your support on this.
GiRRL_Earth
2:27 pm on Tuesday, November 20, 2012
@Richard
I too remember during the 70s and 80s when pretty much everything was closed on Sundays. It was nice. I wish we could go back to that.
Ruth Boncorddo
11:55 am on Friday, November 16, 2012
I think the old laws should be put back. I've worked jobs where I had to work Sundays and wanted to be with my family. Nowadays people are always trying to think of ways to get away from family time.
There is plenty of shopping time without getting rid of blue laws. People don't spend more if stores are opened more. There is definitely too much craziness with all these sales. I use to love Christmas shopping when people were happy and looking around. Now people are grabbing, fighting, pushing, etc. and took all the joy out of Christmas shopping. I now give money or shop online.
Richard W. Lunt
12:25 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
Avon,
Those are other areas the government should have some say in.
Avon Barksdale
12:29 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
Perhaps a list tucked in your shirt pocket would help you remember better next time. Love your ideas on freedom, keep up the good work.
GiRRL_Earth
2:27 pm on Tuesday, November 20, 2012
What's with Avon's straw man arguments? Talk about taking this topic off course. :-|
Just Saying
1:04 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
So you can't go shopping on Thanksgiving or Christmas, but it's ok to go to a movie? Now I get it!
deb of see-attleboro
3:45 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
And don't forget those Thanksgiving Day high school football rivalries!! Who ever came up with that nonsense anyway?
mark
3:45 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
Are Blue Laws hurting anyone? What's the harm in keeping them in the books?
Just Saying
4:30 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
Massachusetts, Rhode Island, and Maine are the only states that prohibit retail stores from opening on Thanksgiving. Many people that want to shop will just go to NH to shop & they won't be paying any sales tax. Less sales tax revenue hurts everyone in the state, in one way or another.
deb of see-attleboro
5:48 pm on Friday, November 16, 2012
Just saying: If this is no big deal then why are there rumors that retail giants such as Walmart and Target will experience job actions nationwide this holiday season?
Just Saying
2:59 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
I didn't say it was no big deal. And, since retail stores have traditionally been closed on Thanksgiving, I would expect there would be some backlash from the employees the first few years, until it becomes the norm. But there is a right way & a wrong way to entice employees to work, and Walmart & Target have yet to figure that out.
alan lury
2:59 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
Its okay with me... lets also open the stores at 9pm on Christmas Days so we get those after Christmas exchanges and sales started sooner!!!!.... Taken and unwrapped from under the tree at 7am...back in the return lines at 915 pm!.. only in good old USofA
Darren Major
2:59 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
I have no issue with blue laws - why not have a litte peace - not every moment of the week has to dedicated to someone's bottom line - give that time to people and their families or what ever private thing they want to do
Darren Major
2:59 am on Saturday, November 17, 2012
In a western state I lived in - overtime charged at 3x normal wage was required on holidays - it certainly cut down on holiday business
Crazedkooks
9:44 am on Sunday, November 18, 2012
I think we need to take a minute here and regroup. The "Blue Laws" are in place for several reasons. Lets take away the spending, the shopping, money and greed and think about what the holidays originally mean. Thanksgiving is not supposed to be about shopping or deals or parking spaces. Christmas is definitely not about gifts or Santa. We as a whole have succumbed to the false meaning of these holidays. We are in a world of I want, I want, I want. If we get rid of the Blue Laws then please remove the holidays as there will no longer be any meaning to them.
deb of see-attleboro
2:34 pm on Sunday, November 18, 2012
I agree. There really is no point to holidays. Get rid of the blue laws. Get rid of all holidays. Every day should be just like the next day and just like the day before. In fact, every day should be gray. No more sun, no more clouds. Let's eliminate color. Who needs green. Who needs red or white or blue. I want all my music to be the blues and all my days to be gray.
Just Saying
2:34 pm on Sunday, November 18, 2012
If you are unable to find meaning in the holidays due to the fact that some stores choose to open, then you have already lost the meaning.
Fiscal Conservative
3:14 pm on Sunday, November 18, 2012
I'm not going to shop between now and New Years, at the minimum. I don't believe that one has to "buy" for holiday spirit. As I said earlier, I'm an "Old Fart" set in my ways. I had, in earlier times, been caught up in the "spend to keep up with the Jone's way of life. It did nothing for me, except cause tension in the family. Now, the kids are grown and they have to put up with the mess that retailers put on people. For the spouse and I, Thanksgiving (family visiting) and Christmas will be quiet, sitting by the fire after church. We'll have a nice Prime Rib dinner at Christmas, talk to family (our closest are 250 miles away. They should spend Christmas with their children, at home, not travelling to our place) and crash early. Grethcen Robinson: we're not heathens, as you may think. Children & grandchildren are definately taken care of, just not the way you would want.
Next day, meet our children half way to pick up the grandkids for a week of fun. New Year's eve, our annual celebration with the grandkids "Three Stooges Marathon". Bed before midnight. Why celebrate another year of bills, dysfunctional govt (fed & state) and so many other things going on that are wrong. I'm not shelling out money for overpriced, lousy food and crappy entertainment. Yeah, Gretchen Robinson, the more that I think about it, I'm a real, first class "old Fart". At least I'm honest enough to admit my faults, unlike others.
GiRRL_Earth
2:27 pm on Tuesday, November 20, 2012
If the Blue Laws are eliminated and in turn, retail stores are allowed to open during the holiday, then that will mean people will have to work and retail managers will have to find employees willing to work. I say, keep the blue laws and give people a rest! If you worked in retail, would you want to work during the holiday or would you prefer a chance to relax and enjoy the holiday?
I can remember a time when retail stores were not allowed to open on Sundays, the exception was pharmacies and gas stations. I remember Sundays were quiet -- barely anyone was out driving, roads were quieter... it was nice. IMHO I think we should go back to that. Everyone deserves a day of rest!